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Razakin Oct 11, 2016

Can't imagine why anyone would like to vote for Trump when he clearly wants to sexually assault hot women, and doesn't understand it either.

And he's a shitty businessman, 4 bankrupts and the "small million dollar loan from daddy'o", + rumours of loaning more from his siblings, and where the hell are the tax returns?

Also, guy can't take any criticism at all, throws tantrums like a small baby. But guess that's why he has baby sized hands. tongue

GoldfishX Oct 11, 2016

Jay wrote:

Seriously, if the things he says are what people actually WANT to hear, that's a huge society problem right there.

I won't waste time defending EVERYTHING the man has said, but I find the other side even more offensive and out of touch with society.

Again, Trump is saying, "there's a problem", the other side is saying, "we need to continue on the path we're on" (which to me is bollocks). And again, while Trump goes about his manner in a vulgar way, I think the political left in America is far more damaging and destructive in wooing people over to their side, albeit in a much more covert manner, which causes government dependence. Which of course, translates to easy votes.

How are they going to fix the economy? $15 an hour for a minimum wage and free community college? Doesn't help the middle class, only the poor and unskilled. It certainly won't help create jobs. Raise taxes? They're pissing away the money they have. Oh the unemployment rate is going down...Look how good we are? No, people are falling out of the labor force because they're giving up looking for jobs. Healthcare? Premiums are creeping up, the benefits are actually decreasing and publicly traded insurance companies want nothing to do with Obamacare, which did nothing to curb costs.

Now mind you, I'd much rather see Marco Rubio standing up there as the GOP nominee (and in four years, after Hillary wins this election, that's a very real possibility). But we're kind of stuck with Trump. And all Hillary has to in order to win is continue the smoke-and-mirrors tactics that the Obama administration has gotten away with for the last 8 years. Which does absolutely nothing to help me.

Kirin Lemon Oct 11, 2016

I have nothing kind to say about Trump or those who support him at this point.  You support a deeply ignorant, narcissistic man-child who lashes out at the smallest imagined slight.  You support a hateful racist who courts white supremacists.  You support someone who actively encourages violence against those who disagree with him.  A professional con man who has never once acted in the interests of anyone but himself.  A truly disgusting man who gleefully insults women at every turn, treats them only as objects, and brags about sexual assault.  You want a shakeup of our government?  Sure, I get why people might want that.  But Donald Trump has absolutely no redeeming qualities, and if you support him while knowing full well what he is, you are nothing short of an astonishingly terrible human being, perhaps irredeemably so.

GoldfishX Oct 11, 2016 (edited Oct 11, 2016)

I hope you're prepared to say that to approximately 40-50% of the US voting population. Sorry, that attitude accomplishes nothing.

Just curious...Did all of this hate for Trump exist when he was openly liberal/Democratic not even a decade ago?

Kirin Lemon Oct 12, 2016

GoldfishX wrote:

I hope you're prepared to say that to approximately 40-50% of the US voting population. Sorry, that attitude accomplishes nothing.

Just curious...Did all of this hate for Trump exist when he was openly liberal/Democratic not even a decade ago?

About 36%-ish currently, but sure, if they actually know all of these things and are perfectly okay with them, then yeah, they're awful.  Eager apologists for racism and sexual assault are the lowest of the low, and they deserve to be called out for what they are - total garbage.

And I think it's probably safe to say that Trump wasn't much more than a punchline a decade ago.  He was a bloviating businessman and tabloid personality who nobody took seriously until his racist attacks on President Obama's citizenship, which is when he started to amass a following among the uninformed sludge of America.  "All of this hate" for Trump exists now *because* people have gotten a chance to see what a terrible person he truly is.  I'm just grateful the racist little troll has been his own worst enemy this election, and tanked his own chances.  There just aren't enough crazy people out there to get him elected, thankfully.

GoldfishX Oct 12, 2016

You're entitled to your own opinion and I will not engage with you further. No point, especially if you lump those of us that see Trump as the lesser of two evils with legit Trump ralliers together. "Lesser of two evils" is not equal to "perfectly okay with his antics". We're STUCK with the guy, we're not openly worshipping him. Heck, I openly talk to people that think he is simply Hillary's insurance policy to get herself elected. Again, I'm far more offended by the Democrats' complacency in staying the course with their own failures (as well as my own financial future) than a couple blowhard remarks and clown-ish antics that most people just shake their heads at.

And I don't think we're going to see anything resembling a fruitful political discussion in this thread. I tried. I've been critical of censorship in the past, but if Adam wants to nuke this thread, I have no issue.

GoldfishX Oct 12, 2016 (edited Oct 12, 2016)

avatar! wrote:

Trump was never liberal and not exactly liked by many people, including (especially?) "liberals"...

"Robert Crumb and friends flush Donald Trump down the toilet, 1989"

http://dangerousminds.net/comments/robe … oilet_1989

A quick Google search reveals it's not quite that cut and dry. He WAS a Democrat at one point (early 2000's). I don't think one single article from 1989 quite captures that.

But again, this has been a common complaint from the GOP side regarding Trump.

And as far as jobs go, I mean manufacturing jobs and well-paying white collar jobs, as well as the natural creation of jobs (both small and large business) that occurs when the economy picks up. Essentially I am saying I want to see a booming economy and I don't think that is going to happen in this current political climate (not to say it would happen in a Trump administration, but at least he has correctly identified the problem and I agree with his critiques)

avatar! Oct 12, 2016

GoldfishX wrote:

And as far as jobs go, I mean manufacturing jobs and well-paying white collar jobs, as well as the natural creation of jobs (both small and large business) that occurs when the economy picks up. Essentially I am saying I want to see a booming economy and I don't think that is going to happen in this current political climate (not to say it would happen in a Trump administration, but at least he has correctly identified the problem and I agree with his critiques)

Although this may shock some people (considering how much I can't stand Trump), I will agree with you that sometimes he does identify certain issues better than Hillary. That said, identifying a problem is far from fixing it. Trump would make a terrible president, and if the GOP wanted someone in the White House they should have nominated... oh, just about anyone but Trump!

Jay Oct 12, 2016

GoldfishX wrote:

I won't waste time defending EVERYTHING the man has said, but I find the other side even more offensive and out of touch with society.

I'm not saying he's out of touch with society. I'm saying that him being in touch with society, as reprehensible as he is, is a damning indicator of where large portions of your society are. That's the problem. It's not that he is here in spite of putting on a blustery, angry toddler-like personality for the crowd, stirring up xenophobia, sexism and violence. It's that he is here because of those things. He doesn't need you to defend what he says - what he says is why he is where he is right now. And it's dragging you down into a childish pit of ignorance.

Ashley Winchester Oct 12, 2016

Hey, ran into some Trump ads on YouTube. I don't like him either but at least his ads don't make me want to blow my head off like Hillary's.

GoldfishX Oct 12, 2016

Jay wrote:

I'm not saying he's out of touch with society. I'm saying that him being in touch with society, as reprehensible as he is, is a damning indicator of where large portions of your society are. That's the problem. It's not that he is here in spite of putting on a blustery, angry toddler-like personality for the crowd, stirring up xenophobia, sexism and violence. It's that he is here because of those things. He doesn't need you to defend what he says - what he says is why he is where he is right now. And it's dragging you down into a childish pit of ignorance.

I think the ignorance is coming from the people that are paying attention to what Trump says and how he says it, while giving the OTHER side a free pass entirely. Why is it Razakin can rattle off item after item about how awful Trump is and can't be bothered to do a little homework on Hillary's many flaws? And someone in this thread actually said 36% of the US voting population is "total garbage", even if they merely believe Trump is the lesser of two evils. To me that is far more extreme than anything Trump has said or done.

That is a complete political blind spot. I think, at the very least, I've rationalized why Trump is my lesser of two evils, but I'm not seeing the same from the other side. Even Ashley's opening post is a far cry from being "pro Trump".

Again, this thread is pretty much a waste of time until that blind spot goes away and people judge the "other" side as harshly as they are choosing to judge Trump or at least opt to bring something of political substance to the table. Trust me, it's not hard to find holes in Hillary's stances or personality (and with the current Wikileaks story breaking, it's becoming even easier), she just isn't as blatant with them as Trump is.

Razakin Oct 12, 2016

GoldfishX wrote:

Why is it Razakin can rattle off item after item about how awful Trump is and can't be bothered to do a little homework on Hillary's many flaws?

Oh yes, I've rattled so much. Still waiting for some examples of Hillary's many flaws. Hopefully from proper sites and not some infowars/breitbart spinzones. And no, I will not start googling, as if the flaws are so many, should be really easy to link to proper news sites?

And honestly, seems so far that Clinton's faults are at her being a woman and political issues. Instead of the shit Trump has done and seems to be doing, that do make him a bloody awful human being. But hey, be happy supporting someone who has no qualms thinking when he sees group of 10 year old girls that he will be dating one of them when they're 10 year older. Or is that just another biased Clinton-media twisting his words.

Also, only the most extreme side of Dem voters seem to give Clinton the free pass, from what I've seen and read, people would still like to see Obama in charge, which probably is an another red cloth to some people.

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