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Pedrith Sep 25, 2015

At least the developers didn't fall completely silent and then announce bankruptcy after releasing part of the game and none of the backer rewards.  That's what happened with Woolfe - The Red hood Diaries sad

Ashley Winchester Sep 26, 2015

Pedrith wrote:

At least the developers didn't fall completely silent and then announce bankruptcy after releasing part of the game and none of the backer rewards.  That's what happened with Woolfe - The Red hood Diaries sad

Actually, Gamestop ran a story on this and it was full of details... they actually had the backer rewards completed and done but didn't have any money to ship them.

avatar! Sep 26, 2015

Pedrith wrote:

At least the developers didn't fall completely silent and then announce bankruptcy after releasing part of the game and none of the backer rewards.  That's what happened with Woolfe - The Red hood Diaries sad

That really stinks. Always a risk when you support a company on kickstarter, although some are less likely to fail than others of course.

The_Paladin Sep 27, 2015

I'm glad I passed on backing that one, though I'm surprised it blew up.  It's funny that the first two projects I backed still haven't come out yet, though they aren't dead either.

TerraEpon Sep 27, 2015

Oddly enough, the first project I backed is the ONLY one that's come out so far, though another one  has a release date for next month (and I only tossed in enough for wallpaper)....and another is supposed to be out 'for the holiday'

avatar! Sep 27, 2015

One of the games I have been enjoying the most, Lords of Xulima, I backed via kickstarter. So although not all indy kickstarters are gems, some of them are! Although I think Mighty No 9 and that Castlevania-remake-thingy might be great, I did not back them because they're definitely coming out on the PS4, and I didn't really see a reason to pay 4-5 times the cost for the same game...

The_Paladin Sep 27, 2015

Unless you're backing for physical goods that won't be available otherwise, or to have something included in game then it seems like a waste a lot of times.

avatar! Sep 27, 2015

The_Paladin wrote:

Unless you're backing for physical goods that won't be available otherwise, or to have something included in game then it seems like a waste a lot of times.

It's not a waste, because otherwise the game would never got produced in the first place if not for kickstarter! Although that said, I agree that there's no reason to support the game at a $100+ unless you do get something special out of it. Although most games you can get a digital copy for $20, and you help support the game.

The_Paladin Sep 27, 2015

Well, I should have been specific, but I meant with a game that has hit funding it is a waste pledging for a digital copy since most of the time you aren't saving anything and you're vulnerable to the chance of failure compared to being a day one buyer.

TerraEpon Sep 28, 2015

Eh, I've found very often the digital tier is a bit cheaper than the eventual release price. It's mostly small (like $12 vs $15) but it IS there. Plus sometimes you can get in on the 'earlybird' and save even more.
Not every time of course. But I guarantee Bloodstained will be more than $28 when it comes out.

rein Oct 6, 2015

Brilliantly, the project creator has decided to engage with backers in the comments and is scolding them for their anger.  The amount of cheek on display here is NSFW.

avatar! Oct 7, 2015

Well, glad I didn't support that kickstarter! Here is what one backer posted:

"The-Exp Games about 18 hours ago

Hi guys.
I think what we have here is a classic case of people with really cool sprite art skills and no actual relevant game development experience trying to make it work. Unfortunately that's all it takes to get lucky on Kickstarter and even more unfortunately the creators are also terrible at communicating with people who at least at one point, were their fans.

Another factor I'm sure is the fact that during the process of successfully raising $70,000+, human nature got the better of them and it started to cross their mind that that's how much they needed to do it. So when they only ("only") ended up with $40,000+ post taxes and fees, it was already the first miniature kick to morale to them. I'm sure they started out at least with good intentions.

Now that I've played Devils Advocate, I'll move on to calling them out on their nonsense. The updates they post are rude, they lack basic understanding of game development costs and repeatedly put their foot in their mouths regarding the wasting of their money. Yes, wasted. You can say a single penny wasn't spent on anything but food, bills, and game development costs, but what does that even mean? Surely that involves EVERY facet of life. I assume what you mean is that you didn't go out and buy a $30,000 car with it. Honestly I'd rather you had done that at this point, because then maybe you could recoup something at a loss, whereas now what there seems to be is (A) a large amount of really really good sprite artwork, (B) what I assume is a basic demo that couldn't be sold and is not suitably good enough for early access to make any money with, and (C) a GDD which is worth as much as any GDD at this point in a project - less than the paper it's printed on.

As someone who has made coming up on having made, produced and released around 75 games in my career, I'm familiar with projects going stale mid way though and having to fight to get them done. Sometimes it's worth scrapping a project, sometimes it's worth salvaging assets from a project and using them for something else. I know for one I'd love to be able to use the sprites from this game, or even work with the developer in the role of a sprite artist, but I sure as hell wouldn't invest money in this project, it's already beyond toxic and will never make back a tenth of it's budget. I only backed it for $10, so I'm not pining after any major financial loss, but I sure as hell won't be fed the untruths of these worthless and frankly rude updates once every 2 months without comment.

I'd say it's been a ride, but I don't think this project ever really got up over the first hill and at this point from experience I don't think it would survive without crashing and burning even if it did.

Best of luck with your future projects, and I hope this learning experience won't put you off making games, which is incredibly fulfilling. You just aimed too high first time. Epic minds really is a suitable name for the developers, it's a shame that passion, amazing sprites and imaginative minds alone don't finish a game."

avatar! Oct 7, 2015 (edited Oct 7, 2015)

As a follow-up to what I posted above, I have to say that it's not like all first-time developers are doomed to fail or be underwhelming. As I've said before, Lords of Xulima … and-humans

raised only $35 on kickstarter. Now, they did have other funds to be fair, but in the end, their game (which I received months ago, and was the first game for this studio) FAR exceeded my expectations! In fact, I've had more fun with Xulima (put in numerous hours) than I've had with many AAA titles!!

So, in the end it's hard to tell what will succeed or not. I suppose there can be "warning signs" if a game is too ambitious or does not have any details whatsoever. Still, I do think kickstarter can be amazing, and I really am looking forward to receive the next Xulima-like gem.

avatar! Nov 22, 2015

Got my Pier Solar HD Kickstarter rewards! This is the first kickstarter project I supported. It was supposed to have been released in December of 2013... yup, about two years ago! Still, they pulled through, and it is a nice collector's edition. Here's a pic (not mine)

I'm not a fan of figurines, but they did a very nice job with them. I thought they were going to be plastic, but they're actually ceramic which is really nice! I have yet to play the game, but I will smile
I have the PC/MAC/Linux version. There was also a Dreamcast version... but who still has one??

FuryofFrog Nov 22, 2015

I don't know if Indiegogo counts but I wonder why this isn't already funded. … ullgirls#/

Indivisible is a spiritual successor to Valkyrie Profile and has a demo available on PC and PS4. Lab Zero Games has already shipped Skullgirls proving they can complete a crowdfunded product and yet its struggling to hit its goal, even getting a 20 day extension. If they don't make their goal Lab Zero will dissolve. Ah well. Looks cool as hell.

Ashley Winchester Nov 28, 2015

FuryofFrog wrote:

Indivisible is a spiritual successor to Valkyrie Profile...

I don't know about anyone else but I kind of have mixed feelings about VP in general. However, I've only played the one on the PS2 so I don't have a full picture of the entire series.

I enjoyed the game enough but it was one of those games where I kind of regretted buying at launch. The game was damn beautiful (as it should have been for a late era PS2 game) but the fact I saw all the major twists coming really but a damper on the proceedings.

That said I'm glad I played VP2 (a prequel) first because the person who was the villain would have been even more obvious then they already were.

avatar! Dec 8, 2015

Project Update #17: Elysian Shadows Next-Gen 2D RPG
Hmmm, you have to wonder when you get a kickstarter update that goes like this:

"We had another pretty fundamental team shake-up that has left the project understaffed, and those of us remaining have been slaving away every day in a state of silent depression, doing our jobs along with the jobs of those who deserted us, hoping to god we could make the December dead-line, but always knowing in the back of our minds that we were attempting the impossible and sacrificing our health to do so..."


"Tyler Rogers, our gameplay engineer, left us not long after the last Kickstarter udpate. Only he didn't just leave us. He ripped his server out from under us, took Patrick's bed, took monitors, and took routers, without even so much as a minute's heads up to commit code we were currently working on."


"It isn't all depression and misery on this front. Tyler leaving was actually one of the best things to ever happen to this team and the game. Yes, it has resulted in setbacks, as we were already overworked, but taking over his job has allowed me to make serious progress and focus exclusively on the combat system and gameplay for the first time, and it has been slowly materializing into something freaking awesome that has remotivated all of us. "

They raised $180,000 for the game. I honestly don't care if the game gets delayed. I just want it to be good and ready to go, and I want my physical rewards when the time comes smile
I still believe in them... well, not that I have much choice. But I do hope this succeeds. Frankly, it reminds me of SNES RPGs (which we've been discussing) only with a bunch of modern pros.

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