http://videogameslive.com/index.php?story=108

In other exciting news: as you read this post someone, somewhere in the word, is farting. Very loudly.

I'm sure, just like everything else Tallarico does, it will be overhyped and underwhelming.

The whole "Greatest Hits - Vol. 1" has me turned off already.

What we really need is a Play! Symphony Live CD.

I like how instead of saying 'beeps and boops', it says 'beeps and electrical impulses'.
GIVE IT A REST ALREADY!

Also, could there BE any more hyperbole in that rant?

That was first thing I looked for it in the description. I mean, it's an improvement and all, but still retarded all the same.

It's a shame that these concerts should be such a fine tribute to videogame music and they come off as anything, but...

Trust me.  Try explaining chip music to anyone who's not into games and/or music.  You have to use "bleeps and bloops."  It's really not that innacurate when you look at the individual sine, square, and triangle waves with a channel of noise.

I guess "hums and static," would be a more suitable description that "bleeps and bloops," or maybe even tones and static, if people could understand that, but all of them work.

"Chiptune" is a fine and well-documented description that has at least some musical merit attached to it in place of "bleeps and bloops"...Try that. Trust me, it'll piss off the people who listen to that type of music regularly a LOT less.

Actually, it's not the description that bothers me, it's the anal "LOL, orchestra's automatically better" mentality that bothers me. It's saying a carefully produced chiptune isn't comparable to, say, a douche with a 100 piece orchestra that's playing a shitty piece of music (or a sloppy arrangement of a good piece of music, as it would apply in this case). For what should be a celebration of videogame music, I would think such sounds would be regarded in a better light than as being archaic.

I really don't care about "explaining it to people who aren't into games and/or music" because...um, why the f--- would they be at a game music concert in the first place?

Well, maybe that's why you go to a game concert.  The concerts are aiming to bring in listeners who aren't necessarily into games.  Even people who are into games aren't necessarily avid game music fans, and have no idea what the hell a chiptune or chip music is.  I personally have to worry about how I explain it, especially when trying to write an article that's going to be read by people other than the very few of us who are into game music and really understand it and appreciate it. 

It's kind of an elitist attitude to have to expect gamers who aren't into music or even people working in the game industry to have an intimate knowledge of the history of game music on the level that we have.  I bet a lot of people working on sound teams for gaming companies today have no idea what chipmusic is.

Anyway, as far as better, it's just an issue of quality of music over quality of sound.  Some people can't stand chip music regardless of how well it's composed because the sound doesn't resonate with them.  Perhaps we like it because we grew up with it, which makes sense.  It's not an issue of orchestral music being better or not.  I just don't get why people think game music either has to be standard, generic orchestral music or melodic, fun, synthesized music.  Why can't they make melodic orchestral music?  Some composers are doing it.  I think an album of well composed orchestral music would be more appealing to the mainstream than the same album of tracks in as chiptunes.

And it's a low-brow, self-promoting, mainstream-targetted attitude to default to using "bleeps and bloops" (or whatever) at every possible opportunity to put yourself over (and I mean EVERY. f---ing. OPPORTUNITY. Every single Tallarico piece I see has this. If you want to understand why he's a hated man in the community, here's a prime example). Even if I come as elitist, I'm not the one trying to sell CD's here.

That, or they're intentionally avoiding it and looking for ways to rip off your average film score instead. One of the reasons I feel modern VGM is increasingly becoming a huge joke, but that's a discussion for another day...

You're missing my point. I'm not saying one is better than the other and that people need to be total chiptune nerds. The issue is the description of it and low-brow perception given to it, when it's such an important factor in the history and identity of game music. Even if people don't like it, they should at least respect it.

To use a more recognizable metaphor: even if Iron Maiden fans don't like Paul Di'Anno, they should recognize he was part of the reason for the band's early success and not "some bum to hold them over until Bruce Dickinson was available". I don't think you'd be drawing in too many IM fans (and probably pissing off a good number of them) by using that description to promote a concert of their's nowadays...I hate Paul Di'Anno and I'd still be turned off by it. Imagine how a fan of his would feel.

I won't dispute that at all, as long as the emphasis is on "mainstream" and not people who actually have respect for the history of game music.

One last thing though.  Game music, even in its current state, is not very popular.  Therefore, how can we expect people to appreciate the historic roots of it if people rarely give a damn for what's out there even today?

The art hasn't attained a high enough status to have the common person appreciating the history of it.  Music is still second (or third, or fourth) fiddle to nearly everything else in game development, so it's no wonder that even people in the industry have no appreciation for the history of game music.

No, you don't. I've found that the easiest way to descripe a chiptune is just to say that "it sounds like old Nintendo music." Even though that's not completely correct, it's close enough so that people who aren't into current games or music will be able to relate. I don't know anyone (no exaggeration) that does not know what Nintendo music sounds like. At least that way you're still showing some respect and using the phrase "music", instead of downgrading it to that awful "bleeps and bloops" shit.

... which is why most Western VGM sounds like a cross between a bad Star Wars ripoff and the backing music to Law and Order. I'd love to see someone like Jack Wall or Inon Zur try to write chiptune music; their heads would probably explode while they were frantically looking for the "generic string swell" button to complete their piece.

Substitute "well composed orchestral music" with "Fall Out Boy" or "Ashlee Simpson" or any other mainstream radio act, and that would still hold water. You could also substitute it wit "poorly composed orchestral music", and it would have the same effect.

I wonder if people that are into "mainstream" game music (whatever that means) hear chiptunes and say, "Wow! These must be those bleeps and bloops I've heard so much about!" As far as I'm concerned Tallarico and everyone else that promotes old game music as such has done nothing but tarnished and instantly degraded old chiptunes. It's like, "That old stuff sucks, it's just primitive and noisy computer sound chip output. Listen to this amazing and revolutionary orchestral drivel! THIS is real game music!"

One thing you have to remember is that most people's perception of game music is the shit that these American composers are pumping out. Of course it's not going to be popular.

I just refer to phones melodies when someone is clueless about old-school game music. Most phones even today have plenty midi samples played through PSG/FM units alike older game systems (often with one of those defaulting as standard ring tone). If you know how to port some catchy chiptune to a phone you quickly have a winner at hand. The bias against such game music is mostly related to it being both too obscure (even most gamers don't care for it) and the game industry being way too hardcore and niche up till now, not the music's own merit (which is always ignored anyway).

I don't know, the thing that's gotten under my skin lately is I have a few friends I played the Lost Child discs for and it pissed me off the first thing they said was "the instruments didn't sound real enough."

WHO IN THE HELL came along and said everything one listens to has to sound 100% realistic? I fired back at them and said the Kingdom Hearts music you like doesn't sound that real now does it? - that's all synth (outside the vocal themes) through and through my friend. I don't want all my music to sound realistic as possible or be done with live instruments!

Sorry, I'm just angry some people can't look beyond sound limitations and see the things that matter like composition. Ugh, I guess it's pointless to try and change some people's perception of game music.

Even without knowing this most people care for the performance/sound design/mixing first and for the composition only second. Otherwise the acceptance issues with e.g. chiptunes but also game music in general (the complaints about synths the composers use for SSBB nicely shows this again and again) wouldn't exist as that about the purest form a composition can take apart from deeper performance/sound design/mixing influences.

Well, "fake" instruments exist to emulate the real thing, so it's understandable that you'd prefer the real thing and not want to listen to a synthesized mock-up.  However, when you get into electronic music that is intentionally electronic (not emulating real instruments like guitars, strings, etc), that's an entirely different story, and whether you like it or not is just a preference.  Many would argue that since the technological limitations are lessened or gone, why would anyone in their right mind compose with anything less of the real thing?  Chip music is different, because a sine wave doesn't sound like it's emulating a string sample, but to use a crappy string sample when you know they have something better available to them is pointless.

What I seem to get from people the most is, "Why aren't there words?"  I've found that people who hate game music also seem to hate jazz, orchestral, and any other form of music that is not vocal.

But anyway, we can only be videogame music nerds up to such a point where, for me, it just seems pointless to get angry that people don't "get it," or people dumb it down to something less than what it is, like Tallarico.  Whether he's doing it to sell records or not doesn't matter to me, it's just good that the public is getting to read the countless interviews and news story about VGL and other concerts and are actually becoming aware of game music.

If the silly semantics issue bothers you all so much, why not join GANG to promote industry awareness of the rich history of videogame music, and that, above all, they're not "bleeps and bloops."

Well, I should have been more clear about the overall situation. What gets me is when you try to share something you have interest in - in this case VGM music - with someone and they turn a deaf ear to it but you're suppost to bend over backwards, embrace everything they enjoy like a one way street... it's not so much a unfavorable disposition towards VGM as it is a person I know unwilling to take anything I say or suggest into consideration. So, I guess I really brought it up for the wrong reason, sorry.  Bottom line is I seriously need some new friends with open minds.

Which should probably tell you something about game music's underground status and why trying to make it appeal to the mainstream is a bad idea.

I'm not angry at the people who don't "get it" (the mainstream will be the mainstream...You can smack them upside the head and try to guide them, but you can't get mad when they don't go your way), I'm angry at the people who are trying to put themselves over by making themselves look like the face of videogame music and trying to sell themselves as producers of untouchable art, especially now that they can hide behind a massive orchestra and imitate your average film score...At the expense of something that drew most "real" game music fans to the stuff to begin with. This is not the type of "awareness" I want to see in regards to game music. I can't stress how glad I am to not be in your shoes.

And you want "awareness?" Tallarico invented the concept of using electric guitar in a game. He said so himself here:

http://www.altpop.com/stc/forums/viewtopic.php?id=888

Do you really want to see more of that type of "awareness"?

Because people working in the "industry" should be aware of the history to begin with and should already be promoting it, not looking down at it. I'm not wasting my time to educate a bunch of jokers wanting to make a name for themselves now that game music can use live orchestra and gaming is popular and especially when my current opinion of most of the established western composers can be summed up with the flush of a toilet. That's fighting a losing battle.

Well, alright.  I can agree with all of that.  It just seems that everyone is so angsty and gets riled up by his comments.  It's kind of silly considering the status of game music, even in the industry itself. 

Trust me, you have NO IDEA how unwilling game companies are to promote games through the music, which is what the film industry does.  I'm literally beating my head against the doors of some of these companies trying to get them to realize it.

Anyway, didn't you know TT is the most prolific and famous game composer in the world?

Well when the guy says stuff like "I was the first to use electric guitar" -- he's sort of asking for it.